Tag Archives: twelve Imams

Imami Shia say: Prophet Adam (as) did not testify to Wilayah of 12 Imams

Sura TaaHaa Ayah 115 “And certainly We took a covenant from Adam before, but he forgot; and We did not find in him any firm resolve.”

Imam Muhammad Baqir (asws) said, “And certainly We gave a covenant to Adam before, but he forgot” refers to the taking of an oath from Adam (as) regarding Muhammad (saw) and the Imams (asws) after Him but Adam (as) was negligent in His oath. Adam (as) did not have the “firm resolve” to recognize the true status of Muhammad (saw) and the Imams (asws). The reason behind giving the title of Olil Azm (owners of the “firm resolve”) to the five Olil Azm messengers is that Allah took an oath from Them regarding Muhammad (saw), His Successors and al Mahdi (atfs). They, the five Olil Azm, testified to this oath with “a firm resolve” they accepted the oath as the truth.”

(Al Kafi vol 1 pg 416, Tafseer Qummi Second Edition pg 65)

Abu Hamza narrates Imam Muhammad Baqir (asws) said, “Allah took a covenant from the prophets and said, “Am I not your Lord?”

The prophets replied, “Yes. You are”.

Allah asked, “Is Muhammad (saw) not My Messenger? Is Ali (asws) not Ameerul Momineen (asws)? Are His Successors not the authorities appointed by Me? Are They not the keepers of My knowledge? Is al Mahdi (atfs) not the one with whom I will support My religion? Is He not the one through whom I will spread My government? Is he not the one through whom I will avenge My enemies? Is he not the one through whom the people will worship Me, willingly or unwillingly?”

The prophets replied, “We believe in this covenant and we testify to this, O’our Lord”.

Imam Muhammad Baqir (asws) then said, “Adam (as) did not deny this covenant but He did not testify to it. Therefore the religion was announced through the five messengers who testified in al Mahdi (atfs). However Adam (as) did not have the “firm resolve” to testify. This is the meaning of this ayah.”

(Tafseer al Burhan vol 5 pg 191, Taweel al Ayat al Dhahira pg 313)

Sura Furqaan Ayah 26 “The kingdom on that day shall rightly belong to the Beneficent Allah, and a hard day shall it be for the unbelievers.”

Ali bin Asbaat narrates from some of Our companions, “The kingdom” belongs to Allah on “that day” and on every other day but the above ayah refers to the rising of al Mahdi (atfs) when everyone will worship Allah.”

(Taweel al Ayat al Dhahira pg 369)

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Imam Baqir marries a woman whom his father dislikes

Shia Infallible Imam marries a woman whom his infallible father dislikes. (Note: We Sunnis don’t believe they are infallible nor do we believe they are Imams of the Shia. They are free from Shia sect, may Allah have mercy on them).

مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ يَحْيَى عَنْ أَحْمَدَ بْنِ مُحَمَّدٍ عَنِ ابْنِ فَضَّالٍ عَنِ ابْنِ بُكَيْرٍ عَنْ زُرَارَةَ قَالَ حَدَّثَنِي أَبُو جَعْفَرٍ ( عليه السلام ) أَنَّهُ أَرَادَ أَنْ يَتَزَوَّجَ امْرَأَةً فَكَرِهَ ذَلِكَ أَبِي فَمَضَيْتُ فَتَزَوَّجْتُهَا حَتَّى إِذَا كَانَ بَعْدَ ذَلِكَ زُرْتُهَا فَنَظَرْتُ فَلَمْ أَرَ مَا يُعْجِبُنِي فَقُمْتُ أَنْصَرِفُ فَبَادَرَتْنِي الْقَيِّمَةُ مَعَهَا إِلَى الْبَابِ لِتُغْلِقَهُ عَلَيَّ فَقُلْتُ لَا تُغْلِقِيهِ لَكِ الَّذِي تُرِيدِينَ فَلَمَّا رَجَعْتُ إِلَى أَبِي أَخْبَرْتُهُ بِالْأَمْرِ كَيْفَ كَانَ فَقَالَ أَمَا إِنَّهُ لَيْسَ لَهَا عَلَيْكَ إِلَّا نِصْفُ الْمَهْرِ وَ قَالَ إِنَّكَ تَزَوَّجْتَهَا فِي سَاعَةٍ حَارَّةٍ .

Muhammad ibn Yahya has narrated from Ahmad ibn Muhammad from ibn Faddal from ibn Bukayr from Zurarah who has said the following:
“Abu Ja‘far, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, said to me, ‘I wanted to marry a woman but my father disliked it. I went and married her and afterwards I went to see her. I looked at her and did not see anything attractive to me. I stood up to leave but her guard with her went to the door to close it on me. I told her not to do so and she could have what she wanted. When I returned home to my father and informed him about it, he said, ‘You only owe to her half of the mahr (dower).’ He said, ‘You married her during a hot hour.’”al-Kafi, Vol. 5, p. 366 (Majlisi graded it Muwathaq)
Wasail al-Shia, Vol. 14, p. 208

Note: This narration is missing from the Urdu translation of al-Kafi.

Comments: Imam married a woman which his father disliked. This was not appropriate for him to do so, since his father was infallible. Moreoever, he made a second mistake when he married her during ‘a hot hour’. The Imam was unaware of it, while it is strange, when compared with the rest of Shia ahadith which mention the knowledge of Imams from the childhood.

By Kalaam (Islamic-Forum.net)
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Shia Scholar: There are no narrations with the names of 12 Imams

al-Salamu `Aleykum,

Shia scholar of Hadith Muhammad Baqir al-Behbudi writes in “Ma`rifat al-Hadith” pg.172:

على انك عرفت في بحث الشذوذ عن نظام الامامة ان الأحاديث المروية في النصوص على الأئمة جملة من خبر اللوح وغيره كلها مصنوعة في عهد الغيبة والحيرة وقبلها بقليل فلو كانت هذه النصوص المتوافرة موجوده عند الشيعة اللإمامية لما اختلفوا في معرفة الأئمة هذا الاختلاف الفاضح ولما وقعت الحيرة لأساطين المذهب واركان الحديث سنوات عديدة وكانوا في غنى ان يتسرعوا في تأليف الكتب في اثبات الغيبة وكشف الحيرة عن قلوب الامة بهذه الكثرة

[And you (reader) now know after the research on “al-Shudhudh `an Nizam al-Imamah” that the narrations about the general identity of the Imams such as the narration of the Tablet (1) and others, are all fabricated during the time of al-Ghaybah (2) and al-Hayrah (3) and some short time before it. For if these narrations were available with the Imami Shia, they would not have disagreed so openly and greatly about the identity of the Imams, nor would the biggest personalities and narrators of Hadith have faced much confusion for long years, nor would they have needed to quickly write books proving the Ghaybah to unveil the confusion from the hearts of the nation in such great numbers.] 

(1) Narrations of the Tablet are those when Jabir (ra) walks in on Fatima (ra) and sees a tablet with the names of the Imams on it.
(2) al-Ghaybah is the period of occultation of the Shia 12th Imam when he was never seen nor heard from by anyone except four people and only for a couple of years, then followed by the greater occultation.
(3) al-Hayrah is the great confusion that struck the followers of the Imami branch of Tashayyu` when the news of their Imam stopped reaching them after the death of the fourth emissary and lots of them abandoned the Madhab.

no_name_of_imams_1 no_name_of_imams_2

By Hani
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Questions on Imamah and 12 Imams by a former Shia – part 2

Posted by 13S2010

بسم الله الرحمن الرحیم

This is part 2.

[Start of Quote]

1) What is the rational justification of the imams practicing taqiyyah? 

The rational argumentation presented by the imamiyyah FOR imamate is that they are guides for the ummah, and Allah out of his eternal justice HAS to appoint imams for the ummah, or the ummah cannot be held responsible for being misguided (Al-Kafi). But if the guides practised taqiyyah in their teachings, then can the deceived sunni masses really be called ‘misguided’? We have many short-chained narrations in sunni books in which the imams deny being divinely-appointed imams, denying al-raj’a, and professing love for the first 3 caliphs. So can we really blame the innocent sunnis who sincerely thought that the imams were being serious when they said that?

2) Did the imams openly declare themselves to be the 12 khalifas of the Prophet? 

If not, can we really blame the sunnis, zaydis and other muslims for going astray? Surely, it would be the duty of an imam to declare his imamate to the ummah, and not a small circle of followers. They were, after all, imams for the entire ummah right? We see that many shias went ‘astray’ because of the quiescent attitude of imams Sajjad and Ridha. How, then, can we blame those who did not follow those imams?

3) The list of the members of Ahlul-Bayt naturally differs for the different shia sects. Each believes they are right. Some had the following of some prominent shia scholars of the time. Which one is right?

Abil-Jarud (Ziyad bin Mundhir) was a companion of Imam Sajjad, but he became a Zaydi. Ibrahim Bin Salih Al-Kufi was a companion of Imam Baqir, and stopped at him. Also, Ali bin Al-Hasan and Muhammad bin Suma’a are other examples that come to mind. My point: different scholars/companions of the imams differed after the death of an imam. Who should the laity follow? The fomation of the kaysaniyyah and the numerous other shia sects was the direct result of this confusion. Each sect had the backing of scholars and companions of the imams, and they all thought they were right. Who, then, is right?

4) Did the imams and very very close companions only know who the 12 imams would be? 

This seems to be the argument of some 12ers. But this seems to go against many ahadith in which insignificant lay-people narrate ahadith about the Prophet naming the 12 explicitly. How then, did the laity know about them, and the close companions of the imams didn’t? We see them in many narrations coming to the imams and begging them to tell them who the next imam would be (which the imam would and the companion would ecstatically kiss the head, hands and feet of the imam). What was the need for this, if the Prophet had indeed named all twelve?

[End of QUOTE]


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Questions on Imamah and 12 Imams by a former Shia – part 1

Posted by 13S2010

بسم الله الرحمن الرحیم

We have already published an article of this brother here where he mentions the reason he embraced correct Islam and rejected the sect of Shiism. In this article we will post some of the Questions that he asked the Shia. These eye-opening questions are for the open minded Shias.

[Start of QUOTE]

سم الله الرحمن الرحیم

اسلام علیکم

I will start off by stating that I am not starting this topic with the intent to get the shias here angry, rather I want to hear their honest opinion and would like to see it backed with proof. And of course, I hope to gain more knowledge in the process.

In case you didn’t quite understand what’s up with the name of this thread, I named three (amongst numerous others) of the descendants of Ali who claimed to be imams other than the ones accepted by the ithna asharis. The reason for this thread is to discuss the manner in which the imamat was passed down from imam to imam, and the proofs of this inheritance, as per the testimony of authentic historical documentation.

I shall make this post comprise mostly of questions, and hope that most (if not all) will get answered with satisfactory replies. So here goes:

1) What do ithna asharis have to say about Muhammad ibn Hanafiyyah (the step-brother of Hassan/Hussein)?

Is he regarded as a pious person? Why is it that the majority of shias, after the death of Imam Hussein, regarded Ibn Hanafiyyah as the next imam? Didn’t Hussein tell the shias explicitly who the next imam will be? If so, then why were the shias so confused for the longest time about who to follow, and started following different people from the descendants of Ali(علیهم السلام), until (after quite a long time) it was decided that Ali bin Hussein was the imam?

2) What do ithna asharis say about Zaid bin Ali bin Hussein, Imam Baqir’s uncle?

What do they say about his claims to imamat? Did Ali bin Hussein not tell his *own* children who the next imam was, leaving it up to the shia community to decide? Why is it that Zayd did not have anything against Abu Bakr, Umer and Uthman? Is it possible that Ali, Hassan, Hussein and Ali bin Hussein DIDN’T actually have any feelings of animosity towards the aforementioned people? Could it be that this animosity was created later on and attributed to the ithna ashri imams?

3) What do ithna asharis think of Muhammad (an-Nafs az-Zakiya) b. Abd Allah b. al-Hasan al-Muthanna b. al-Hasan b. Ali b. Abi Talib?

History shows that he was the biggest rival of Jafar as-Sadiq (just like Ibn Hanafiyyah was Imam Ali Sajjad’s, and Zayd was Baqir’s). Again, I raise the question: how could this man claim to be the imam, and a large portion of the shias were adherants of this man? Didn’t al-Hassan bin Ali (علیهم السلام) tell his *own* children who the imams after him would be? Why the mass confusion amongst the shi’i masses? He was known to be quite convinced of his role as the imam of the Muslim ummah, and had debates with the caliph al-Mansur as well. Is it possible that the shias of that time believed that any pious person from the Progeny of Ali was a likely ‘candidate’ for an imam? By seeing the numerous cases of Aliids rising up, claiming to be imams, it seems like that is the case.

What I understand from all this is that shiism was in a very turbulent situation, and the majority of the shia masses did not know who the imam of the time was. There were numerous ‘fake’ imams and they were contemporaries of the ithna ashari imams, and some times their followers exceeded the followers of the ithna ashari imams. So if a Muslim (who believed in the wilayah of the “Ahlul-Bayt”) was present there, WHO would he follow?

I can only conclude from all the historical documentation that the Prophet did *NOT* explicitly name the 12 imams, because if He (صلی الله علیه و اله) HAD done so, there wouldn’t be SO much confusion.

I am willing to hear the replies of shias here, and although I don’t intend for sunnis to post here, it IS (sadly ) an open forum.
It is my request to sunnis to please keep their posts relevant and to the point. That is my plea to shias as well. I would also like to request the shias to be open-minded, honest, and to back their claims with proof.


(PS: These historical facts can be found in many history books, and are aknowledged by shia scholars like Tabatabai and Syed Hussein Jafri. Please refer to “Shi’a” by Tabatabai, and The Origins and Early Developments of Shia Islam)
(PPS: Its interesting to note that the followers of some other ‘fake’ imams also held those imams to be infallible. hmmm….. I find that very interesting)


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